Episode 137: Talk w/ Rising Appalachia Members, David Brown and Duncan Wickel

0:00 Welcome to this episode of Uncle Dad Talks. I'm Uncle Daddy. With me as always is the ever so charismatic, the handsomest one of all, give it up for Mike Hampton, or just Mike as you all know. What's up Mike? The intros never get old. Thank you. Hello, hello. Thank you, Uncle Dad. They should never get old because I want you to feel hyped up every single time. Because you know what? You deserve to feel that way, Mike. Somebody has to know. And I just get old, so there we go. Older. Older, there you go, right. Plus, we have a very, very special episode as we usually do. Today we have two, arguably people that could be your brothers.

0:43 I was looking at you guys, I was like, oh man, it's Mike's family here. Do yourself a favor and call. Also, Super Studs. So let me tell you, this is a stud fest today. Mike, go ahead and introduce our audience Our guests, and this is one of those episodes where Mike's going to take the keys, and I'm going to be coming in here and there. So, Mike, take those keys, and enter control over the Rising Energy Cups. Yes, thank you. And you just keep it easy over there, big guy. So, we've got, yeah, we've got, I'm excited to announce these guys. I really love the band that they play in, one of the bands that they play in, and we'll talk more about that. But two of the members of the band, Rising Appalachia, and we have David Brown and Duncan Wickle.

1:26 Duncan I said your last name correct yes okay I was, singing in the mirror over and over hoping I'm saying it right but yeah so thank you guys for coming on I know the band has produced about what nine studio albums I think there's other like remix albums, you guys have toured all over the world, toured in some of the best venues in the US I would say like Red Rocks Preservation Hall in New Orleans and that's just with with Rising Appalachia. And I know you guys tour with other bands too. So welcome to the show, guys. Please say hello. Thank you. Thank you, Mike and Uncle Dad. It's a pleasure to be here. I miss you all.

2:09 Yeah, thanks so much, guys. I'm really tickled to be on your podcast and to get to chat it up. And so you guys, just so the listeners can know, because we can see your beautiful faces, say your name so people can put the name to your voice. Sure. Well, I'm Duncan Wickle and I play fiddle and cello and do various other things in Rising Appalachia. And this voice belongs to me, David Brown. Yeah. And I think David wins. You guys listening can't see it, but he wins the award for best background out of all of us in our little windows here. I thought you were going to say best hat.

2:50 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's also wearing a Barbara Jack. Go figure. Yeah. David. So where are you at right now, David? That has that that beautiful backdrop? I am sitting at a friend's kitchen table in Basalt, Colorado. And this is more or less been not this house in particular, but this region in general has kind of been a second home to me for the past several years. And Duncan and I actually were just about a dozen miles up the road from here this winter and working on a project that I'm sure we'll get into. But yeah, this is really one of my favorite parts of the world outside of Asheville where I grew up. Right on and yeah and Duncan you look like you're you look like you're in a recording studio but I don't I don't know where where where is what's that red thing behind you?

3:37 This is indeed some sound treatment that's behind me. I picked the corner of my house with the least amount of chaos. I'm currently moving to Nashville this week, so I'm a little upside down. But yeah, you're dead on. It's my currently turned upside down home recording studio. You know, for a second, I actually thought it was a classroom. I was like, oh, he's at a classroom. So you're going from Asheville to... for the kids that's right he's in the after-school class so you're going from ashville to nashville is that right well my wife actually just finished the program in connecticut so we've been living here we've been we've been moving a lot kind of since the pandemic which i think will continue into the future we're kind of just being nomadic nomadic couple of musicians yeah because y'all when when when when were you all in paris was that pre-pandemic or post-pandemic uh we can't we arrived here from overseas about a year and a half ago.

4:39 We were there for about 10 months. That's right. Yeah. Y'all have really been covering some ground for sure. Yeah. Well, Asheville is such a beautiful place. So, so let's talk about that since we've, we've mentioned it several times here. So the band, so the, the band's brainchilds, Leah and Chloe are from Atlanta. How did, so how did you guys meet and all come together to, to form, to form the band or join the band, I should say. Who is? Well, it's a story with many layers, of course, like most good stories do have. I have a friend who I met in Asheville maybe about 20 years ago, this amazing musician by the name of Kalen Campbell, who I've got to credit for introducing me to both Leah and Chloe and to Duncan.

5:25 He and I were in this bluegrass band right when I was finishing college. This was like 2005. The band was called The Greasy Beans. And Kalen was kind of like an older brother to me. I didn't grow up with any older brothers, but he introduced me to a lot of stuff, including old time music. And foraging for food and just kind of living this off-grid kind of semi-feral lifestyle, which was kind of something I was pretty passionate about there for a little while. all. And I guess it was within a year or two of becoming friends with him that he got out a CD and it was a burnt CD. And it just said Leah and Chloe Rising Appalachia on it. And he put it on and we were driving to this gig in Tennessee.

6:08 And it was these two sisters, the two sisters of Rising Appalachia, the Founding Sisters. And I was just so smitten with the sound. I'd never heard an approach like theirs to the traditional Appalachian music that we're all so passionate about. And as the way things go, a few years went by and eventually I started to sort of run in the same circles as Leah and Chloe. And eventually they invited me to sit in for a few gigs, which turned into about, I think, 12 years now of playing together. And around the same time that I first met them, I was playing what's called a concert dance with this guy, Kalen, in Asheville.

6:50 And Kalen, at the time, to me, was probably the best fiddler I'd ever heard of or had the chance to play with. And he said, I really want you to meet this teenager. His name's Duncan. He's 19, and he is so good. And I was like, wow, I've never heard... My favorite fiddler talk about another fiddler in such high esteem. And so within a few nights, Duncan and I were playing together and we just had a total blast. And that began our friendship. And maybe Duncan, maybe you can chime in with your side of it from there. Yeah. And long before I met David, I also knew Leah and Chloe independently of that from a series of summer workshops that would go on nearby, which I first attended when I was 11 in Swannanoa, called the Swannanoa Gathering, which, if you know, it's about 25 minutes outside of Asheville proper.

7:47 And we kind of, we were, I'd say that we were acquainted. I was more of a sort of like scholarly nerd about fiddle music from the area and and from elsewhere and and they they were already kind of on to being the the excellent performing performance artists and stage crafters and just kind of mystical artists that that there are that they're known for now i mean i guess at the time they would have been teenagers as well, and and and then i would see them at the leaf festival which is also if you're if for any listeners familiar with the ashville area you'll probably know about that the leaf festivals and And it's like a legacy cultural thing in the area.

8:33 I would see them there the following, like I would see Leah and Chloe pop up and be like, Oh, Hey, those are those girls from Swananoa. And every year at the leaf festival, their audiences would, it would grow and grow. They would, it would grow from. Them kind of doing tweener sets in the front of the main stage on on a little like muddy dance board but while the crew set up the next band they were kind of like yeah you guys can kind of play and pretty soon the the crowds gathering around them in the front became bigger than the crowds that were coming for the main acts and they started to really kind of dominate and headline leaf and become associated as their kind of child band of the leaf festival And I saw that growth happen gradually over a very slow amount of a period of probably 10 years or so.

9:28 And I never in my life imagined that I would have such a close working and personal relationship with them. I wasn't running in that circle, but I was very adjacent to it. The actual music scene in the early 2000s was very small, and that's how we all knew of each other. Me and David knew each other independently of Lee and Chloe, and we all were pretty well acquainted, and it finally kind of all meshed together for us at the right time. David, I'd say, heavily lobbied, I don't know how he'd say it in his words, for me to be in the band. I think they were honestly a little skeptical at first. from my reputation or their association of me being a kind of conservative fiddle nerd, if you will.

10:19 But eventually, we all won each other over, and I'm so glad that we did. I've been playing myself with them for about seven years now with everyone, and the relationship just deepens every year. Awesome. Amazing. It's like, uh, you're, you're, you're, they, they've broken you down to be less, the less conservative fiddle player they work to win. So how does that work though with, with you guys, with them, when you're, when you're making a song, do they come to you guys with, with the melody and lyrics and say, all right, now you guys write the music or is it something that's a collective? I'm sure there's different things for different songs, but what's like a it general give me an example of how you come up with a with a song together yeah i'm sure that process has changed a lot over the years and maybe david has more to say about how it's evolved.

11:11 I i think what what i've noticed since my involvement is is that there really is this nucleus of leah and chloe working on a scene together and that's a that's a very, working on a song can it can be a very intimate thing and and so it has i i think often that's kind of often but how it happens but there can be a pretty large variety additionally to how things kind of unfold in natural ways i mean they they they can be inspired by like a groove that's going on from within the circle of the band when we're just like playing during a sound check or something leo will just like be walking around with a phone like oh play that again we'll just like improvising something.

11:57 Totally. So at some point, somebody is going to go through all these voice memos on her phone and, you know, 20% of them are just going to be sheer gold, like the inception moments. And then some of them are going to be us just acting so strange, being like, what was happening at 3.44 p.m. in Santa Cruz? But yeah it's really run the quite quite a full spectrum of of the way songwriting has happened and and frankly i think the the pandemic and you know it's affected us in so many different ways but but i think one of them was that it it separated us like it created a lot of space between us for almost an entire year and so i think that really changed the way some of our songwriting looked what i would say would probably be my favorite way that we've come up with music is literally when we just get all of our instruments out for several days, and we're just in a space together.

12:58 And we might have this agenda of like, okay, this is what we're going to work on now. But maybe when somebody's preparing a meal, a couple of the band members get out their instruments, and some interesting little musical conversations just kind of start happening. And then somebody's like, wait, what if I did this with that? And the next thing you know, there's a really beautiful song just kind of emerging between us. But it's also really fun to be on the side of things where Leah or Chloe, they usually do, they definitely write the lyrics to the songs that we do. And sometimes they'll just bring a song that's underway, but they're looking for our input in it. And it's really fun to just figure out ways that we can all contribute something to it.

13:40 Yeah, that's great that it kind of becomes a communal effort You all can kind of have that openness to put something to it because sometimes it's not that way with a band, right? Like you're just, you're all sharing a dream job and basically have to be on the same page or willing to be enough on the same page. And I think it also relates to the kind of people that come and see all shows. It's the same kind of communal kindness, openness, and willingness to kind of work together, right? Yeah. And would you agree? Wholeheartedly, personally. Yeah. I mean, I think one of the interesting things about being a touring musician is that you play a lot of the same songs like many times in a row.

14:27 And it's just such a gift to be able to kind of come up with your own part for it and have it feel true to oneself, as opposed to somebody just handing you a chord chart or something like that and just saying, play this. But you get to feel like your your soul is coming through it in a bigger way and i think that feels really good i'm curious is there ever a challenge with collaboration like do you ever feel like collaboration it can't be as easy as it should be there's definitely a lot of trust in this band and i'm really grateful for that i think that that's not something to be taken for granted Having worked in, me and David both worked in a lot of other bands, and anyone who's ever been in the band, or a marriage for that matter, or had a family, or traveled intensely, can basically imagine what that dynamic would be like if you had to do that full time.

15:23 Time there's a lot of beautiful trust there's also a lot of negotiating that has to happen and that can take a lot of time and energy and sometimes you know of course you're like wow this is taking so much time and energy is it really you know is this is this is trying to push my idea forward really worth what what i'm putting into this, And usually, I mean, we've all been doing this a long time and we know each other pretty well. And I think we're all in the band, we're all pretty solid. We're surprised all of us fairly mature communicators, I think I could safely say.

16:07 And it's special. it's special i think it's why i've i think it's a huge reason personally why i've been in this band as long as i have at this point as opposed to maybe some other ones i i didn't stay with as long. Yeah i think i think sometimes getting together to to make music with somebody is especially something new it can kind of feel like you know when when people at a zoo put two pandas together And they're just trying to, they're hoping that they're just going to make a baby happen or something, but it feels a little bit contrived. But thankfully we, we haven't encountered too much of that in, in our little project.

16:48 Usually, you know, there's, there's plenty of creativity in the air, but I think we've both had those moments where it's like, wow. So I guess, I guess this is, this is what's supposed to happen right now. Yeah. None of us have seen any pandas more beautiful than, than us. All together oh there's some beautiful pandas i'll tell you so so yeah communication like i love what you said uh mature communicators because that's not everyone you know no matter how old of a panda you are is is going to be a great uh mature communicator so i know you know it's it's it's it's happening that the band is going to take a break a sabbatical and so how do you guys communicate how does that communication go like are you guys like well what are we going to do now we're in a band real quick you don't have to go too deep into it but like how does it how does how does that conversation kind of unfold and then refold into a lovely way for y'all.

17:49 Well, yeah, I think, well, I think for me, you know, I'll speak for myself, of course, I'm the youngest member of the band. I think I was maybe of the party that was a little bit like, less ready to, to be like, Oh, yeah, let's take a break, you know, in the middle of things going really well. Because this band, we've been on the up and up, I think. It's really much by design. And it's kind of deliberate in the face of a lot of progress in recent years for the band, I think, in the career of the band. Which I think strikes a lot of people as odd.

18:30 But there's a number of good reasons for it that I recognize and respect. In fact. We're taking a sabbatical from being on the road. We're working on a lot of projects and filling the coffers, to use an analogy that our leader, Leah, loves to use with new material that we're going to have on lock and ready. We're going to be ready to release an album by the end of the sabbatical. We've also just released an album which is a covers album that that came out last week, falcon anchor falcon anchor it's called there's some really beautiful songs in there there's everything from willie nelson to erica badu and hosier songs that are favorites of flea and chloe and favorites of the band so so we're really taking this time you know when you're on the road as much as we are it's hard to really give the attention that your material deserves, in this you know your your studio material in your your your compositional material, it's it's hard to to keep that stuff at at your your standard of quality that you want to with so much moving around and and logistical things happening all the time so i think we all see that this as an opportunity to really hone in on those things and we're.

20:03 So we're working on that all the time together and got a lot of things to look out for on the horizon. Yeah, I would just chime in and add that, yeah, in terms of the decision to take a creative sabbatical this year, I personally, my first reaction was sort of like, wait, I felt like 2020 was one heck of a sabbatical for me. I didn't play any shows at all. Like, I've kind of had this attitude of just like, put me in, coach, you know, put me in, put me in, let's do this thing. I'm not getting any younger. But after that initial reaction, I just found myself reflecting a little bit on so many of the decisions that Lee and Chloe as leaders of the band have made that probably too, as Duncan hinted at, that too, like a lot of people, they might have said, why are you all doing that?

20:56 That just doesn't make any sense in a conventional music career, say, to instead of, I don't know, shopping around record labels in Nashville or L.A. To to go study folk music in Bulgaria for the summer. Like little things like that when they were young women leading all the way to the way that we've toured over the years and the things that we've turned down. But they've all turned out. I mean, I can't think of any time that a decision that Leah or Chloe have made hasn't worked out really well for us. And so, although I had some initial resistance to the idea of like, kind of really slowing down, the more that I felt into it myself, remembered the trust that I have in their leadership, which is really special.

21:45 And I think like Duncan is saying too, it's just really important to carve out the time to remember why we do what we do and hopefully come up with some new stuff too. Otherwise, we're just kind of like a... We risk maybe repeating ourselves and I don't think we want to be doing that too much. Yeah. Yeah. You want to have some new, new, new gems to kick, right. From, from when you guys play the next, the next new round of shows and, you know, just to set it more profoundly. Yeah. Right. I really need some fresh gems, but you know, and obviously they know, they know what they know, what they're doing. And you know, you guys, like you said, Duncan, you guys have been successful and you've continued to rise, no pun intended.

22:30 But yeah, just as like a visual artist too, like I do tons of events and shows throughout the year and I fill my calendar up. And if I don't give my time, the actual space to work on new stuff, it's just going to be the same, the same things that I'm selling over and over. And at some point people will be like, dude, where's your new stuff? You know, I can't wait to hear it. And so while While that's happening, or something happened, and I think you guys, you know, I want to dive into the details of it. Not long ago, you guys, both of you, David and Duncan, are on some kind of retreat in Colorado, and you come up with the idea to come up with an acoustic album together while this kind of sabbatical thing is happening.

23:11 Is that kind of the gist of the way it goes? Absolutely. Yeah, me and David, you know, our musical relationship started out primarily, you know, pre us being in Rising Appalachia together, playing Irish music and old time music together on banjo and fiddle and guitar. Right. And we were doing an event at the Bayul Retreat Center, which is run by some dear friends of ours near where David is right now, outside of Basalt. And we were doing a Rising Appalachia event there this winter.

23:52 And we're kind of, you know, the sort of cliff of this determined sabbatical was starting to loom closer and closer. Closer and we were kind of we were we were sharing a cabin together me and david and david's espresso machine and we were sitting around for a lot of days and and one day we we were we were discussing a lot you know like what you know well how about all the all the uncertainty and everything we're kind of relating about that and and a certain point we just started playing some tunes the way that we used to going back to our roots together and you know just it it felt really good and it made a lot of sense to be doing that it was there was a comforting thing about it and and i think that that was the point that the the seed of the idea came together like you know this is a beautiful place where we are in this wooden cabin out here in the the total wilderness and just a snowy blanket of forests and mountains and streams and an espresso machine, I'll add. And we...

25:05 And I think that was the beginning. That was the moment where we were like, well, we should make this an official thing. We should actually bring some proper equipment out here to this spot. There was some time where we were like, well, we should just do it in Asheville because it's just logistically it's going to make sense and it's going to be less expensive to us and everything. But we really felt like there was a magic in that place that we had to capture. Capture and and so it became pretty evident that that was what we should do yeah it was it was especially evident because like we we talked through the the concept you know like hey what if we just did this this year like we don't have much on the schedule and then the espresso machine just kind of gurgled in affirmation and i was like and we're like perhaps it's a sign i think think that's why duck and mentioned the espresso machine but it was certainly a well caffeinated moment of inspiration for sure so so wait let me get this right so you do an espresso machine came up with an idea to make an album in the cabin in colorado in the snow while everyone else is possibly some other stimulants than caffeine oh that's what i figured yeah well you know if you're You're in a safe space.

26:28 I mean, hey, what are you going to do? You have to. So not only did you lug your espresso machine in there, so did you lug, so correct me if. Did you record it or did you just write the songs and rehearse them and you're going to record them in Asheville or is everything in the can ready to go? We are in the finishing stages of it, actually. Yeah, to backtrack a little bit, our band, we did a tour of Colorado back in February and it ended at this place that Duncan mentioned called the Bayou Retreat, which is this amazing old like hunter's lodge with a bunch of kind of satellite cabins around it and for several years now our whole band has been going there and hosting these like small intimate shows there and gatherings that include you know song workshops and all of our little spinoff side projects and around that time yeah we were drinking espresso and we were playing a lot of tunes and And we were, you know, everybody was kind of scheduled to leave within a few days.

27:32 But we had this conversation and this inspiration. And a lot of people there were really, as soon as they heard about it, they were like, yeah, you should totally do this, including the folks, the friends of ours that run Bay Yule. And we started thinking about dates in which we could head back up there later in the winter. For me, it felt really important to do it in the winter just because I'm just a huge huge lover of powder and snow and just the peacefulness of that. And so we started to look at some dates together and think through the logistics of how we could get both of ourselves and all of our quite a few instruments back across the country to do it and what support we might need to ask for from other people.

28:16 And it ultimately led to a Kickstarter campaign, which which we're really happy to say went very well. And so we got back up there, we recorded it, and now we're just in the stages of doing the sort of post-recording work. Duncan's spearheading the mixing of it, and... There's a lot of things that go into an album, especially when you're looking at making physical copies of it, like with vinyl and CDs and that kind of stuff. So we're working away on all that right now and trying not to have too tight of a time frame of when to expect it being out. But hopefully it'll be here in the next few months. You know, you guys, that's some sounds like some fun little side projects that, you know, I need to get involved with. but some of my fun side projects are alphabetizing my comic book collection.

29:06 So you guys are way cooler than me, but yeah, I wanted to mention you guys, you had your, your, your Kickstarter that, that really surpassed its goal. And two things that the name of the album, we haven't mentioned yet is going to be the long, long branch sessions. One, why that name? And two, how does it feel? You know, and either one of you can take one of these, answer one of these on your own. How does it feel to know like that the fans just are like show that much support, you know, when you guys, could you imagine that you would have that much support from your fans? I guess I should say. Yeah. Well, I will say that it's, it's been incredibly, I don't know if humbling is the word for it, but, but it's inspired an incredible amount of almost a sense of indebtedness.

30:00 A lot of the people, you know, I, I can see who the donors were. And a lot of these folks are strangers to me and a lot of whom are people that I know that decided to take part of their earnings, which just means so much to me personally. I had no idea that folks would just turn out the way that they did. I don't know if I'm expressing my gratitude in quite the right way, but I feel very indebted and really moved by it. It's one thing to be a part of a bigger project and have fans show up, but to go out on a limb a little bit, that might be a connecting phrase to the Long Branch idea, but to go out on a limb and just try something new and to feel support from dozens upon dozens of people for me has been really meaningful for me.

30:50 I don't know about you, Duncan, what do you think? Yeah, I can only agree. I have so much gratitude. and as you said from the folks we don't know which is always a surprise when folks are coming out of the woodwork that you don't even know how they know of you. But also the friends and colleagues and fellow musicians that you know that they're working just as hard as you are to make a living doing this thing. Totally. Yeah, it makes me want to do it right, which is a really cool feeling. It's a really... As an artist, you do face a lot of...

31:34 You do end up in situations where people are expressing a lot of gratitude and joy about what you're doing, and it's amazing work. Sometimes it's difficult, but those moments always make it all worth it instantly. Yeah, I kind of think that if other people are taking you as an artist seriously or showing belief in what you're doing, it kind of forces us to do the same about ourselves. selves.

32:14 And I don't know that I've never felt like, oh, wow, this actually is important until other people showed me in a sense that it was important to them. And that was really beautiful. I will say just a brief note about the name since you asked. So this retreat center that we've mentioned several times, Beul, it has several cabins on it that are probably about 100 years old. And the one that we were staying in when this fateful kind of jam session and conversation happened that that cabin was called long branch and so we just thought well if we just record an album up here at long branch with all of its old timbers and kind of slightly askew floors and all its old charm maybe we could just name it the long branch sessions it has a nice ring to it Yeah, it has a nice rustic vibe to it, which we felt like was appropriate for the aesthetic of this particular release that we're going for.

33:13 And the whole experience for us that we wanted to make sure it came across to the listener also. That's awesome. I mean, yeah, I love that you guys were doing the retreat. And then here comes an album and an idea for a Kickstarter and everything. Uncle Dad, you and I need to go do a retreat together, it sounds like, so we can get our ass together, right? I was literally thinking the same thing. I was like, we've never done that. We've got to do that, man. We've got to do a retreat and reconfigure what we can do next. I also wanted to add really fast on what you guys were saying about your support from your audience. It's truly something special when you realize that there are other people out there who connect to this in a way that maybe you will never understand.

34:00 They connect to it in a way because it makes them think of something specific or whatever. Right and that to me is like the best branch anybody can offer right is the can hold on to that because you know kind of like the name right you're you're giving them a branch to hold on to so i think it's very good do you guys beautifully said, he's been doing really he's been doing really great at at saying very heartfelt things and so i want to commend them for that on the show very good yeah but to you guys let me really Really quick ask, is there vocals? Are you guys doing vocals on this album, or is it just strictly acoustic, the instruments that you play?

34:44 I think it's about... So we have, I think, nine songs in the can, give or take, and it stands at about half and half. It's a pretty equal balance of instrumental, fiddle, and banjo tunes from Appalachia and the British Isles and Ireland. And songs, the bulk of which, and I'm singing about half of those songs, David's singing about the other half of the song. I think it's basically two songs. I sing an original song of mine and a traditional song. David sings a really, really beautiful song that's a contemporary song.

35:27 And also, maybe you want to talk about your songs, David. The two songs that David sings, I think, are very well fitted, knowing him as a person. And having said too much, I'll hand it over to you, David, about your thoughts. But yeah, I'm singing a couple songs. David's singing a couple songs. Well, I will say this. Duncan has one of my favorite voices. I mean, he's a beautiful singer. And to me, it was a real no-brainer to get him to sing on at least a couple of the things on it. And myself, I've always felt a lot more comfortable as an instrumental accompanist and as a DJ and all kinds of things, ways of playing music that don't involve me actually having to sing.

36:15 So it was a little bit of a stretch for me. And I guess it was a bit of a part of that branching out process for me to harp on the metaphor a little bit more. But I'm really glad we did it. I mean, I'll be totally candid here. Like some of my favorite albums have a mix of, say, like instrumental guitar playing or other instruments. Then there's a few tracks on it. I'd love Duncan, your opinion on this. But like some of my favorite albums have some mix of both. And I usually just skip over the singing. Like I'll just skip those tracks because it just interests me less. But I thought to myself, you know, that's a really silly reason.

36:59 And like, that's not the way that most people feel about music. And, and when I am really truthful with myself, there's actually some songs that are really meaningful to me that I think people would enjoy hearing. So I kind of just got over my little feeling about instrumental versus vocals and just kind of went for it. And I'm stoked to hear how they turn out when Duncan's done mixing them. Yeah, I have to say that I was really pleasantly delighted to... When I, when we arrived to do the retreat and, and I didn't know if, you know, what, what songs, I didn't know that, that, that, that one song wild rose in the mountain is one that David's saying. So we talked about recording.

37:44 So there was one that was a for sure. And I didn't know if he was going to bring any others. And he arrived with some really beautiful candidates that were connected to his family and place and culture that I really appreciated that, but that he chose to approach it from that sort of true-to-his-heart kind of angle. So one of those made it on. I believe it's the Shaker melody, right, David? Yeah, it's an old Shape Note melody. Yeah, it's Shape Notes. Sorry, yeah. Yeah, which is, if anybody listening isn't familiar with Shape Note singing, it's a style of singing that really took hold on the East Coast, And I think in Appalachia in particular, in the 18th and 19th century, and it was a style of singing that was all oriented around shapes like triangles, diamonds, squares, and each shape kind of represented a tone to people.

38:42 And so choirs would see these shapes written out on pages and they would sing these notes together. And it's some of the most haunting and powerful choral music I've ever heard in my life. They're one of these melodies. I'm trying to remember what the words of the original melody were. It's gosh, it's worth looking up. It's something to do with welcome, welcome every guest, welcome to our festival or something like that. Like somebody could do a pretty funny remix about it because it's all about a festival of sound. Anyways, more recently, somebody wrote new words to it that really have to do with a sense of connection to place. And...

39:25 It, it's a really beautiful melody. Yeah. I'll just say that. And the words mean a lot to me as well. So I'm excited that we got to drag it down in that kind of in a, a personal take on that shapeness style. I love that you guys are singing, David. I've heard, I've heard you play, I've heard your DJ, but I never heard you sing. And so, but also if you guys have room and you need a hot 16, I'm happy to come and throw down a verse on a track for you guys and, you know, spit some flows you know on the remix and let me know and i'll fly i'll fly right over nice, you guys have to do it you have to do it well i i think it would be important we'll decide yeah well you're slicing a duet right now that will be this can be your audition oh okay are you ready mike i can do your i can be your hype man you gotta do your ad-lib that's what i would be i'd be the ad-lib guy.

40:24 Hey i in the words of you 40 i don't i don't freestyle don't rap for free oh sorry see how i got out of that one man well okay so i know we're gonna we're gonna slowly start to wrap up here but so you guys are pressing records and so if people didn't you know contribute to the kickstarter is this something that you guys are gonna have available online for people to purchase or like are you guys gonna do a tour with just the two of y'all for this for this project like what's the once you're done and the album's ready is it going on spotify like what are all the details so that we can all hear it sure enough yeah so we'll be publishing it to pretty much all the platforms that people listen to music on these days in terms of you know via the internet at things like Spotify and Apple Music and Bandcamp and Tidal.

41:17 And we are going to do a limited run of vinyl and probably a few CDs in there too for the diehard folks that still consume music that way or listen to it that way. And one of the, well, the very top tier of reward that we did for our Kickstarter campaign was a in-home sort of house concert with the two of us. And we actually have a nice spread of shows where people signed up for that. So I think hopefully pretty soon after we have our albums made, we will do some travel and maybe as soon as late summer or early fall to play some shows. And maybe we'll try to put a few more together in conjunction with that.

41:59 And we'd love to sell the physical copies at those. And I would say beyond that, people should just reach out to us. And I think we could probably figure out a way to get an album in the mail or a CD in the mail for those that want one. Where would people reach out to you or give us, give us a couple, a couple, you know, you could do your website or your Instagram or what's the best way if someone's listening to get ahold of you guys? Yeah, sure. Well, I think, I think what we're both most well known for is, is our main band, Rise in Appalachia. And if anybody wanders over to say like the Rise in Appalachia Instagram or Facebook page, it should be pretty simple to find their way to Duncan or I's personal accounts.

42:47 My handle on Instagram is Castanea Sounds, and not the easiest to spell. And Duncan's also got an intentionally misspelled one. It's, what is it, Duncan? My Instagram, it's America with a K, underscore runs with a Z, underscore on, underscore Duncan. D-U-N-C-A-N, which is how I spell my first name. America runs on Duncan. Awesome. It's going to be up there until I get a seasoned assessed letter. And in any case, you can also, I update my website as much as I can at duncanwickle.com. D-U-N-C-A-N-W-I-C-K-E-L.

43:28 I would suggest that somebody search for David Brown on Google, but there's quite a few imposters out there. David, why don't you spell, would you please, because Castaneda is also your DJ name. And you want to spell that for our listeners just in case they're listening and they want to just type that in and go directly to you. Yeah, I would be so honored if anybody wanted to make a note of it. It is C-A-S-T-A-N-E-A. And then the second word is sounds. And Castanea is the word, the Latin genus for the chestnut tree, which is a really special tree to the people of Appalachia.

44:11 And it's got a really amazing story behind it, which we might need to save for another podcast. But anyways, Castaneda with a C sounds, and that's a Gmail or on Instagram. Yeah. I love that both of your Instagrams not just relate to you, but they relate to where you're from. Yours from the chestnut trees of where you live. And Duncan, you were just in Connecticut where there's a million Dunkin' Donuts on every corner. So that's clearly why that happened. Am I right? Yeah. Yeah, I was born in the North. I consider myself a North Carolinian because I lived in Asheville from age six to about 18. Before I was six years old, I lived in the Northeast.

44:52 And I was made fun of by the kids on my block who always called me Dunkin' Donuts. And I just remember when I moved to North Carolina when I was six, I never heard it. And I was so happy. And then the moment I moved to Boston in 2007 to go to college. I walked into a Dunkin' Donuts, and the first friend that I made was like, hey, it's a Dunkin' in the Dunkin' Donuts. And I was like, no, this shit again. It's like a bad Twilight episode. I'm moving to Nashville next week, so it's all going to be over. You know what, though? Dunkin' Donuts are just called Dunkin' now. Actually, did you know that? They dropped the donuts. We're supposed to take my name from Donut.

45:37 People are so nice. So you guys are also, I know there's a few tour stops that you guys have left with Rising that are throughout the month of June. Listeners can go to risingupalachia.com and see what you guys are playing in Asheville. I know you guys are playing in Big Sur at Tree Bones, which is such a really cool place. So everyone, please go there. Uncle Dad, do you have any last questions? He always likes to do that to me. I'm going to throw this out there. Yeah. I'm going to throw this out there. Mike, you know I love throwing things out there. When you guys do some shows and you guys are out here on the West Coast and you guys need someone to give you guys the best intros ever, you let me know.

46:19 I will do it for free. And see Uncle Dad. That's a great name. I'll bring you hype, man. No problem. I can get everybody ready to go. Just let me know because I would love to have the opportunity to introduce you on one show. If you want. We'll do it for free. We'll definitely take you up on that. Please do Mike I think we're good Yeah I just have one last question And it's very serious Does the espresso machine Make a guest appearance on the album, Just because you said that I will include a soundbite on the album There we go And not to be confused With an espresso machine Out of Dunkin Out of Dunkin Donuts I think that would be like A.

47:04 That would be like the sound of like a fryer exploding or something. Yeah. We don't like, nobody likes that. No one wants to hear that. David, Duncan, uncle, dad. Thank you guys. We all, we're so happy to have you guys on and we're so happy to the success and the fan support that your album is coming out. Again, it's called the long branch sessions and we'll stay tuned. And, and we will also help promote it when it does come out. And thanks again for coming on guys. Appreciate you all. Thanks so much for your support. Thanks, guys. Absolutely. Mike, before we leave, you got to be the one that had us out. Come on now. That's right. And just to remember, we're not uncles, we're not dads, and we will see you all next week.

47:49 God, and I totally screwed up that we're someone you can talk to. I was like, come on, dude. I guess I need an espresso. Jesus. Rewind. Mike, Mike, I can edit that part out. Do it again. Are you sure? Yeah, I'm going to do it. Okay. I mean, it's kind of funny. Like, we can't do it without you having you exit us out. Come on now. All right. We are not uncles. We are not dads. We are just someone that you can listen to, and we will see you all next week. Music.